Original Article Title: The Next Crypto Boom Has Already Begun

Original Article Author: The Rollup

Original Article Translation: Plain Blockchain

In this in-depth interview, we invited Alex Vanovic, co-founder and CEO of Nansen, to explore the future of on-chain analytics, the disruptive power of AI agents, and the grand vision of the crypto world transitioning into the "real-world era."

Alex will exclusively unveil how the Nansen mobile app, through innovative AI agents, transforms complex on-chain data into an intuitive "agent experience," allowing users to track the movement of "smart money" as if conversing with an expert, and preview the upcoming transaction execution feature.

Furthermore, in his role as one of Hyperliquid's top validators, he will analyze the three-stage model of the crypto narrative from "innovation" to "industrial overcapacity," boldly predicting how stablecoins and RWAs (Real-World Assets) going on-chain will elevate the current crypto market into the "real-world toys era," and share his unique insights on over-financialization and the concept of a Balaji "network state." Get ready to stand at the forefront of data science and see the future landscape of crypto.

1. Nansen Mobile App and AI Agents

Host: Alright, let's dive in. The Nansen mobile app has launched on the app store! Can you introduce why it's considered the best "agent experience" in the crypto space? What can it do for users?

Alex Vanovic: Absolutely! One of the main issues we've faced in the past is users finding the product hard to use, not knowing which dashboard or metric to look at. So we thought, why not envision what investing in 2030 would look like, and then go ahead and do it now? For many software products, the traditional user interface might be disappearing, and in the future, you might just need to converse with an AI agent.

After downloading the app, besides tracking your portfolio, the cool thing is you have an AI agent that understands your portfolio and can access all on-chain transaction data. This means you can ask it questions like, "In the past 30 minutes, where has smart money bought meme coins on chains like Solana or Base?" It can fetch real-time data and give you answers within seconds.

You can choose quick mode or expert mode. I could even paste a transaction hash, and it will analyze user behavior for me. This is a whole new way of navigating the blockchain.

Host: This is very intuitive. You can ask all sorts of questions, inquire about the Smart Money's trends over different time frames. Ultimately, I think I can just say: "Handle it for me! You know my risk tolerance and trading preferences, go ahead and execute those trades."

Alex Vanovic: I really like how you get straight to the point, because that's exactly where we are heading! The next obvious step is to enable users to directly execute trades within the app, set to launch in November, for example.

I believe that as users operate through this agent trading experience multiple times, they will begin to trust it, eventually thinking, "Why don't I just give it an overall strategy to execute, while I monitor and check?" It's a bit like Tesla's roadmap to autonomous driving, building trust over years of use.

Host: I think this is akin to "ambient trading" or "ambient programming." Have you tested the prototype with trade execution internally? How does it feel?

Alex Vanovic: It's much more fun than clicking on dashboards and watching price charts! It's smoother, more engaging. AI is great at simplifying complex processes, eliminating all the frictional hassle, allowing you to focus on what you want to do.

Now our app is already capable of, once you input the address you want to track, generating personalized preset prompts on the homepage for you. For example, if your portfolio goes up, the homepage will have a card asking, "Why did Pangu (for example) rise today?" You don't even have to think about what to ask, we've already prepared prompts for you.

Host: As someone influenced by emotions, FOMO, etc., it's hard to calmly assess one's own trading or investment performance. But with this app, you can ask, "What was my best trade? What mistakes did I make? Are there patterns in my mistakes?" This is so valuable.

Alex Vanovic: Completely agree! With this app, you can clearly see your trading performance, identify error patterns, analyze calmly. It's not only practical but also makes the whole process more interesting and intuitive.

Host: Right? In the future, do you plan to add more memory functions? Allowing the agent to understand more information, such as why I made this trade, or what my overall goal is?

Alex Vanovic: Exactly, we hope to add more memory functions, similar to ChatGPT or Grok's memory files, making the agent more personalized and useful. Users' trade reasons or overall strategies can be stored, and the agent will become increasingly intelligent, providing more accurate assistance.

2. Hyperliquid Validator and the Crypto Narrative Three-Stage

Host: Alright, Alex, I'd like to change the topic. Nansen is one of the largest validators on Hyperliquid. What has been the experience of operating such a large-scale validator? What challenges and controversies have you encountered?

Alex Vanovic: Yes, apart from the Foundation, we are the largest validator on Hyperliquid. We started running a validator for Ronin about a year ago and found it intriguing to align with the community's interests. We acquired a small startup called Stake With Us, and now our staked assets exceed $2 billion, growing over 30 times in a year.

We quickly integrated into Hyperliquid and decided to co-operate a validator with Hyperco. We handle the technology, while Hyperco has a deep understanding of the ecosystem and played a crucial role in the governance vote for USDH.

Host: Speaking of that vote, I heard there was some controversy?

Alex Vanovic: Yes, I'd like to clarify some misconceptions. Some people think the outcome was predetermined, but at least for us, that wasn't the case. We carefully reviewed all proposals, engaged with all bidders, spent a lot of time analyzing. We have an internal scoring system and encourage more proposals to be submitted. In the end, the committee chose to abstain, leaving it entirely to the stakers to decide. The result was very close, with Paxos coming in a close second.

Host: Now that Native Markets has staked and locked $200,000 worth of HYPE, it has ushered in a new era. Many stablecoin issuers have expressed plans to continue launching products on Hyperliquid. Is this what you hoped to see?

Alex Vanovic: Absolutely! Paxos, Athena, these players are all top-notch, and you want to see them all building in the ecosystem. Besides the token symbol itself, I think these stablecoins will perform exceptionally well.

Host: As one of the largest validators, what do you think the next stage of Hyperliquid will be?

Alex Vanovic: It's hard to say, the Hyperliquid ecosystem is so rich! I believe all narratives or innovations in the crypto industry follow a three-stage process.

Innovation: Hyperliquid is an innovator in full-stack derivative trading.

Cloning: Variants of similar concepts start to emerge.

Oversupply of Industrialization: Someone found a way to mass-produce these clones.

For example, in the case of meme coins, Dogecoin is the innovator, Pepe is the clone, and Pump.fun is a factory that created 84 million meme coins.

Interestingly, Hyperliquid has a project called Based, where they built a WordPress similar to Hyperliquid, allowing users to deploy their own frontend interface while the backend remains Hyperliquid. This model is very clever, and perhaps oversupply of industrialization is a bunch of Hyperliquid frontends, which is actually beneficial to Hyperliquid.

Host: You brought this up, and I'm curious, who will be the winner? Will Hyperliquid continue to lead?

Alex Vanovic: That's a key question. The innovator may indeed be surpassed, but Hyperliquid's unique advantage lies in its technology and community. If oversupply of industrialization is a bunch of Hyperliquid-based frontends, then it remains essential infrastructure that is difficult to fully replace. However, the competition will be fierce, and the future will be very interesting.

Host: This makes me think of Tether as the stablecoin innovator, then came the clones like USDC, and now we are in the industrialization stage. Do you think stablecoins or other categories have already overextended, or are there still some areas in their early stages?

Alex Vanovic: Stablecoins themselves are still in the early stages, and they have a clear product-market fit. I believe in the next few years, we may see trillions, even tens of trillions of dollars' worth of stablecoins being minted.

The example of Paxos is quite interesting; they did white-label stablecoins like BN USD until they were halted by Gary Gensler (SEC Chairman). **They even 'lost' a lot of text messages and emails, which is absurd.** A business worth billions of dollars was destroyed overnight; truly, someone should seriously investigate this.

3. On-Chainization of Real-World Assets and Overfinancialization

Host: Regarding the impact of stablecoins on the on-chain economy, can you take a broader perspective?

Alex Vanovic: Stablecoins are an example of traditional financial assets being put on-chain, but the dollar is not the only asset that should be put on-chain. In the next few years, securities, stocks, real estate, and more will all be put on-chain, which will make the size of the crypto market pale in comparison. The current crypto market is still very small.

I've said before that by 2040 or 2050, when we look back at the history of crypto, the current phase will be known as the **"Toy World Era"**. We have created many speculative and experimental tokens.

But the upcoming "Real World Era" will bring a value increase on-chain by 100,000 times or even 1,000,000 times. For example, why can't Nansen's equity be put on the chain? If young people could buy just 1% of real estate and accumulate gradually, it would change the rules of the game. The blockchain mechanism makes asset collateralization easier.

Host: You mentioned that the lending market and Aave will be key beneficiaries of more value going on-chain, which is very interesting.

Alex Vanovic: Yes, if you have Google stock or real estate, you would want to use them as collateral for lending, which is very convenient. The core of the blockchain mechanism is to enable asset collateralization, making lending more efficient. I believe Layer 1 assets, some Layer 2 assets, and protocols clearly benefiting from on-chain value like Aave are all good investments.

Host: As we bring more assets on-chain, I want to ask a question about the concept of over-financialization of the world. What is your view on over-financialization?

Alex Vanovic: I lean more towards Milton Friedman's view: if people own something, they will take better care of it. I believe that enabling people to own assets is beneficial to the world. We should strive to create a world where billions of people can in some way be owners, rather than the "you will own nothing and be happy" narrative promoted by the World Economic Forum.

Collateralization is interesting because it could lead to a differentiation between hard assets and soft assets. You can place hard assets like Bitcoin and Ethereum in a DeFi "bank," needing collateralized lending when needed. Currently, this product is mainly aimed at the wealthy through wealth management services, but DeFi makes it accessible to everyone. This is very exciting.

4. Network State Concept

Host: You mentioned the idea of people owning networks or assets, which is at the core of Balaji's network state concept. I know you visited his network school on the border. Can you share your experience there?

Alex Vanovic: It was a fantastic experience. I attended a founder-to-founder event. The network school is still in its early stages, but I am very bullish on what Balaji is building. I love its futuristic vibe, feeling like everyone is collectively building the future. Being with other builders creates an atmosphere where anything feels possible.

Host: What aspect of the concept of a digital nation resonates with you the most?

Alex Vanovic: Having grown up in Norway and then moved abroad, I felt a stronger connection through the crypto community. In a way, this became my primary community, where I felt a sense of belonging. However, crypto is not a country, so it's hard to feel patriotic about it. Balaji is trying to turn this sense of belonging into something more tangible, and I think many people can relate to that.

Who knows, maybe in a few years, we'll all have digital nation passports! Following him is like out of curiosity, wanting to see what his vision will eventually become. His vision aligns very well with our current era.

Host: Alex, thank you for joining the show! You have a holistic view of this industry, connecting the dots and sharing valuable insights.

Alex Vanovic: Thank you for inviting me! Glad to be here.

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